From: Chad Martin <chad@t...> Date: Mon Mar 10, 2003 5:26 am Subject: [NetRep] Rulings Digest #49
Looking at the number of emails in my NetRep folder, and the date on the last digest, this one will be pretty long. Shall we? -------- This recently came up during a game: what if there is a Lure of Power in play were you have to make a corruption check at -4 when you make a succesful influence attempt, and you succesfully influence away your opponents character (bringing that character in play yourself), can you immediatly tap that character to support the check?
*** Nigel Buckle answered this one nicely. The crux of the argument is the last sentance below. When a passive condition is triggered, it is resolved in the next chain of effects.
I don't see why not - both the card and the rules require an 'immediate' action (playing the character and making a corruption check) but the Lure of Power is a passive condition triggered by the influence attempt.
So works like this:
1.Announce attempt, 2.Reveal Character 3.Roll Dice 4.Play Character (or discard if you don't have enough DI/GI) 5.Resolve LoP's check.
Steps 1-4 are part of the influence attempt -------- First off, a deep bow to Chad. I had no idea there were official weekly rules postings to the list--that's really cool.
*** I realize this isn't exactly a question, but thanks. As you can see, I have a hard time making this weekly, but I do try to get to everybody's questions. -------- I assume that a character chooses which of his corruption sources will be doubled by The Balance of Things when TBoT resolves, and there are no recalibrations if that source goes away or another one is added while TBoT is in play.
*** The resource player does choose, and he can choose a different source for each corruption check, if he wishes. -------- I've been poking around in the Card of the Week archives, and I've come up against contradictory play advice in two of the issues. If I have a Ring safely tucked away under Rumours of Rings, can I dump it to satisfy Rolled Down to the Sea?
*** No, because Rumours of Rings allows you play the reserved ring, which is not the same as discarding it. -------- I have Wake of War in play. I play Watcher in the Water. How many strikes do I get against my opponent's company?
*** One per character. If the attack specifies that everybody faces a strike, then Wake of War will not increase the number of strikes. -------- I have both The Moon is Dead and Plague of Wights in play plus Doors of Night. I play a Chill Douser. Do I get to add one strike first then double or double first then add one?
Following the above, if the Chill Douser is not cancelled, subsequent undead gets how many extra strikes?
*** You wouldn't think that this would be too tough to answer, but the NetRep team has had a bit of a time digging through the rules to find the correct rulings and whatnot. We'll get you an official answer as soon as we have one. -------- Smaug at Home is in play. My company (containing Alatar) is moving to Glittering Caves. Is my opponent: required to draw 1 card? required to draw 0 cards? allowed to draw either 0 or 1 card, at his/her discretion?
*** Smaug at Home doesn't matter here, since his text refers to the "moving company." This means that your opponent draws 1 card. -------- Oops, my mistake! I Had somehow gotten the idea that you can only pass one item off if someone gets killed or discarded....or is there a different rule for characters getting bounced back to your hand or thown into the discard pile?
*** Wim summarized the issue nicely:
A full line up (I hope):
The default: when a character leaves play he takes all his possessions (and other cards such as events and allies) with him. (You see this in full effect when a character leaves corrupted or when an orc / troll gets discarded on a body check).
Exception one (most seen): when a character dies from a body check each unwounded character in his company may pick up one item.
Other exceptions: hazards that cause a character to leave play may have their own exceptions written on them. (Best known of these: Call of Home says that a charcter called home gets to transfer one item.) -------- When does "Wizard Uncloaked" or a "Marvels Told" trigger a check, after the Permanent Hazard Events are discarded, or before? I always understood that the effects on the card are resolved in the order that the effects are written. Most of the time, the effects take place, and then the corruption check is done.
*** You understand correctly. The targetted hazard is discarded, then the corruption check is performed. -------- Another question, this time about conflicting Resource Long Events. How are they resolved when they are conflicting? For example, when my opponent plays GoM and then Moon on his turn, what happens when I play Fog during my turn? How about the other way around? (Fog his turn, Moon on mine.)
*** Eljar quoted the relavent part of the CRF, Annotation 26: If at the start of a player's movement/hazard phase, there are multiple effects in play such that their net effect depends on the order they are applied, the player who is currently not taking his turn (i.e., the hazard player) decides the order in which they are to be applied. Once this interpretation is established, all further actions are applied in the order they are resolved for the rest of the turn. -------- Can you discard permanent resources, allies, and characters? If yes, when?
*** Characters can be discarded during the organization phase. You can store items and permanent events that specifically say they are storable during the organization phase. If you really want to get rid of an ally, you can discard the character controlling the ally. I think those are all your options. -------- Can a Ringwraith can have allies both Black Horse and Creature of the other world? If yes, which is the Ringwraith's mode (herald fell rider, or player chooses one of two)?
*** You can have both allies in play on the same Ringwraith if you wish, but according to the CRF rulings on Creature of an Older World: This card will not put a Ringwraith into Fell Rider mode if there are any other allies in the company. -------- When Something has slipped is played on a company and it splits up, which player decides with witch of the split up companies gets the card??
*** This is another thing the NetRep team needs to debate. -------- Is it legal to have more than one unique manifestation (i.e. Strider and Aragorn II) in the character (draft) pool?
*** Yes. -------- Is Sacrifice of Form playable during company-versus-company-combat?
*** No. This one is in the CRF under Card Rulings. -------- Does Fever of Unrest allow Ahunt Dragons to attack outside their normal ranges?
*** No. -------- Regarding The Balance of Things: is the extra, party-wide corruption point from The One Ring a valid target for doubling? Is the Emerald of the Mariner?
*** I'll just quote Philip Carroll and Wim on this:
Philip: Yes on both counts. Wim: Just note that the Emerald is a corruption source of zero points, not of minus one. -------- Is the Balrog avatar card considered Spawn?
*** No. -------- Is a company "facing an attack" only after the chance to cancel it has been forfeited, or is the company "facing an attack" before the chance to cancel as well?
*** A company is facing an attack as soon as the card creating the attack resolves, so it's before they have a chance to cancel. -------- Flies and Spiders - MEDM Hazard Permanent-event "Playable on a character facing a Spider attack . . ."
Spells of the Barrow-wights - MEDM Hazard Permanent-event "Playable on a character facing an Undead strike . . ."
According to this, must the hazard player play FaS before strikes are assigned (as it mentions the attack as a whole, not a strike)?
*** Yes. -------- Flies and Spiders
If the targeted character (whose company merely needs to be facing an attack for the card to be playable) does not face a strike from the attack, does the card fizzle?
*** Yes. -------- Can a FW player have an agent as a starting character? If so, how?
*** Nigel covered this nicely:
Yes, you play Thrall out in the draft (like a character), then later in the draft play an agent and put Thrall on the Agent. Or play open to the summons in the draft (like a character), then later in the draft play an agent and put open to the summons on the agent. -------- I understand that it can't be used in combination with "Thrall of the Voice", but can't figure out why.
*** It can, but not to bring in a 7 mind agent. -------- Align Palantir can't be used for MPs by a FW, right?
*** Wrong. It gives MPs to Fallen-wizards. -------- Do the extra movement/hazard phases from Gangways Over the Fire allow movement to an Underdeeps surface site?
*** Yes. -------- The Balrog is affected by cards like Descent Through Fire and I'll Report You, right?
*** Yes. -------- Cards like Invade Their Domain and Lord and Usurper, which neither tap their site nor require an untapped site, can be played in the same site phase that I've looted a Dwarf-Hold, correct?
*** Correct. -------- Is there any limit to the number of times an item may be transferred during the organization phase?
*** Not according to the rules. -------- If my precious is at barad dur can he attack my minions company with the one ring or i win automatically when I arrive ?
*** You win when The One is "at" Barad-dur, which is the beginning of the site phase. My Precious would have to attack during the Movement/Hazard phase. -------- Swarm of Bats reads, among other things: "playable on a company at a darkhaven, shadowhold or darkhold." If I play fallen wizard with orcs and am at the hero Carn Dum during the organization phase, is this card playable?
*** Yes. -------- Minion Bag End reads: "playable: [...] greater item* (*hero item only)" If an overt fallen-wizard company is at Bag End, can they play a hero item (e.g. Orccrist)?
*** Yes. -------- Great Bats reads: "Tap to cancel the effects of an attack that states 'attacker chooses defending characters'." If my untapped company attacks an opponent's tapped-out company, I technically choose defending characters, however the Great Bats cannot cancel the CvCC, right?
*** Correct, Great Bats cannot cancel CvCC in any case. -------- a deck must consist equal number of hazards and resources. from this point of view twilight is a hazard? can't I count it as a resource?
*** Twilight can be counted as either a hazard or resource for the purposes of deck construction. -------- does old friendship give +5 to an influence check against an opponent's item? or ally?
*** Neither are characters, so no. -------- the playing conditions on two or three tribes present is not clear to me. where are the parentheses of the logical operations?
*** 1) Company must be moving. 2) Company must have one of the following in their site path: a) Two wildernesses b) One shadow-land c) One dark-domain -------- lets assume the site path contains only one borderland and I'm using starter movement. if my opponent plays a creature requiring a border land and I make a wilderness of it by playing master of wood water and hill, what happens to the creature card? discard or back to opponents hand? will it count against the hazard limit? what happens, if the creature is also playable on wilderness? if it remains and can attack, must it?
*** If the border-land is changed, the creature counts against the hazard limit and is discarded. A creature must be keyed to a region type when played, so it cannot be re-keyed after the region type changes. -------- can a character use marvel's told in a company's move3ment phase not containing the character?
*** Yes. -------- does an agent (used as hazard) 's mind count against the general influence?
*** No. -------- can an ally tap to help make corruption checks?
*** No. Allies only work as characters for purposes of combat. -------- if I use (tap) power built by waiting then my opponent immediately plays a marvels told on it, does the hazard limit increase?
*** No. Power Built by Waiting would be discarded before the effect resolves. -------- can i use twilight during opponents movement phase as a resource?
*** Yes. -------- can a company "move in circles"? for example: let A and B adjacent regions., a company starts his movement at a site in A, then moves in these regions ABA the arrives back at he same site (or another site in A).
*** A region may not appear twice in a company's site path. -------- what if the company moves like this: starts froma site in A, then moving AAAA and finishing it at the origin, just for drawing 4 cards? or a site in A and the regions ABAB then a site in B?
*** See above. -------- in solitaire game, where should I keep the drawn hazards, that I cannot use on the given turn? is there a hazard-hand? or should I discard them?
*** There's a hazard hand, I believe. -------- Regarding keying creatures: that is to say, must a particular region symbol in the site path be specified?
*** No. It's keyed to a region type that exists in the company's site path. -------- is it legal to move from bag end to bag end using the shire region (only and one time)?
*** No. -------- can a unique dragon manifestation be played in the same movement phase after leucaruth at home?
*** No. -------- Does the Hero version of Palantir of Orthanc not give MP's to a FW player?
*** CRF, Card Errata and Rulings, Palantir of Orthanc: * Card Erratum: This item does not give MPs to a Fallen-Wizard regardless of other cards in play. -------- If a FW plays a resource at the Hero or Minion version of Isengard which taps and subsequently discards the site, does this make the Wizardhaven version of Isengard unavailable?
*** It makes the Wizardhave unavailable. CRF, Rulings by Term, Fallen-wizard: # If any version of a site is in play or in your discard pile, you may not play another version of that site. -------- At Wellinghall after playing either an Ent Ally or the Ents faction, Ent-draughts can be brought out as a special item. Can more than one Ent-draughts be played (as happened in the book)? Also, can a minor item be played at the site in addition.
*** You can play one Ent-draughts for each ally and/or faction you play at Wellinghall. A minor item may be played during the same site phase, given that the requirements for play are otherwise satisfied. -------- We'll try to get to the skipped questions as soon as possible.
Chad Martin chad@t... Official Council of Elrond NetRep http://www.mdi.net/~chscable/elrond.htm Assisted by: Nigel Buckle, Wim Heemskerk and Travis Took